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17/11/03 - Soham Trial Transcript
Monday, 17 November 2003
SKY News
Richard Latham is the chief prosecutor; his colleague
on the prosecution team is Karim Khalil QC.
Stephen Coward QC is Ian Huntley's defence barrrister.Mr
Justice Moses is the judge.
Other witnesses and lawyers are introduced as they appear.
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MR KHALIL
I have been asked to read the statement of special Constable
Vivian Margaret (inaudible) special Constable of Cambridge
constabulary. Statement 23rd August last year, qualified
to train new recruits to the special constabulary, stationed
at Parkside police station, Cambridge "Monday, 5th
August 2002 I arrived at Parkside police station, about
6.30 p.m. At this time I was aware of the two missing
girls from Soham, having seen the news earlier in the
evening.
I spoke to another special Constable and asked if he thought
we should help with the search. As he went off to ask
the inspector if our assistance was required, I prepared
the lecture ready for recruits training. The rest of the
special constables, together with new recruits started
arriving at 7 or 7.15 pm. Once they had all arrived, the
inspector came in and informed us spoke to the Inspector
and required our help with the search.
We made our way to the police station in our own vehicle,
had been there some 15 minutes, we were deployed to, sent
to Andrews School Soham. I parked my car on the roundabout
just outside the school entrance, and made my way, together
with the other special constables, into the school.
This time, there were about 14 or 15 special constables
and about 8 regular officers. An inspector entered and
asked if we would carry out house to house inquiries,
given the appropriate forms and made our way to White
Hart Lane, Soham. By now it was around 9 p. pm. We conducted
the inquiries for about one and a half hours before being
picked up by a police car and taken back to the school.
I understood we were stopped from continuing house-to-house
inquiries because the residents were complaining about
being woken up at such a late hour. Arrived back at the
school, milling around near to the roundabout, generally
chatting. This time I recall seeing a man with a large
dog. I noticed he was walking from the direction of the
school fields, and my attention was first drawn to him
because he appeared to be wearing light coloured trousers
when I first saw him.
I did not know the distance, the width of the roundabout,
a short distance on to the field away, he was near to
a tree. He walked over to our groups. I understand he
said to one of the groups, he had seen someone with a
black sack over the shoulder and also mentioned going
to a footpath the other end of the school, that they were
suspicious. I had not (inaudible). I was patting the man's
dog, a black Alsatian. The dog was not on a lead, and
was quite friendly. I also recall asking the man what
was the dog was called.
He said Sadie. This man, I later realised, was Ian Huntley.
I recognised him from the television broadcast from Friday,
15th August. I recall by now, he was no more than two
feet away, he appeared calm and unperturbed. I started
talking to him about the dog. He told me she was on heat.
The dog was not on a lead and I thought it strange he
would let it roam while it was on heat. Huntley told me
the dog preferred women to men and (inaudible) spoke to
Huntley for two or three minutes.I became aware that another
specialist, Les Redcapp, was on the radio. As this was
happening Huntley began to walk away."
I will leave it there and turn to St Andrew's School,
Soham, on Tuesday, 6th August, about 8 p.m. to 8.15 p.m.,
with the special constable, "walking across the playing
field, diagonally across the . . . at this time I noticed
a strange smell. a smell I have not noticed before and
hard to describe, a heavy sickly smell similar to that
from a sugar factory - very unusual, it appeared to be
all around the field. The night was still, there was no
wind." I call, please, Special Constable Redhead,
page 1295.
LESLIE REDHEAD
I am Special Constable Redhead, based at Parkside Police
Station, Cambridge.
MR KHALIL
I think you have been a member of the Special Constabry
over 20 years now?
LESLIE REDHEAD
correct, sir.
MR KHALIL
Monday, 5th August last year, were you on duty in uniform
with other special constables at Parkside Police Station?
LESLIE REDHEAD
that's correct.
MR KHALIL
as a group were you directed to go on a search for the
missing children in Soham?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Yes, we were.
MR KHALIL
You arrived in Soham about 8.30 in the evening and then
start house to house inquiries about then?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Correct.
MR KHALIL
Shortly before 11 p.m. were you as a group standing on
the grass verge by a small mini roundabout within the
school grounds?
LESLIE REDHEAD
We were, sir, yes.
MR KHALIL
Did you become aware of a man approaching?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Yes, I did.
MR KHALIL
If I show you a map please can you assist us where the
roundabout was. We can see the school at the bottom?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Yes, sir.
MR KHALIL
And then a place near the roundabout just ahead?
LESLIE REDHEAD
That's it.
MR KHALIL
Is that the one?
LESLIE REDHEAD
That's the one, sir, yes.
MR KHALIL
Did you become aware of a man approaching you?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did sir, yes.
MR KHALIL
Was he on foot?
LESLIE REDHEAD
He was on foot.
MR KHALIL
From which direction was he approaching?
LESLIE REDHEAD
He came from my right sir.
MR KHALIL
If I take the pointer up?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Further over, the two squares of the tennis courts, he
was to the right of the tennis courts.
MR KHALIL
Very well. Was he alone or with someone else?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Alone, he had a dog with him.
MR KHALIL
Was the dog on a lead or not?
LESLIE REDHEAD
It wasn't on a lead, sir, no. It was running loose.
MR KHALIL
Did he continue to reach you and your group of officers?
LESLIE REDHEAD
He did, sir.
MR KHALIL
Did he in fact approach special Constable Scott (inaudible)?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Yes, that's correct, he did.
MR KHALIL
Were you then approached by your fellow officer that the
man had given some information?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Yes, that's correct.
MR KHALIL
Did you approach this man?
LESLIE REDHEAD
The man came to me.
MR KHALIL
He came to you. We know that to be Ian Huntley, did you
know that at the time?
LESLIE REDHEAD
No, sir.
MR KHALIL
You subsequently found out it was?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Yes.
MR KHALIL
Did you speak with him?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did.
MR KHALIL
What was said?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I asked him what it was he had actually seen and Huntley
told me he had been out walking his dog and saw somebody
in the area of the tennis courts, which I just indicated
a moment ago and he had shouted out to the person who
then ran off. He saw they were carrying something large.
MR KHALIL
Did you ask about what he had just told you?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did, because I wanted to clarify how big this item was
the person had been seen running away with. Huntley told
me it was quite substantial, it was black and may have
been in a bin bag.
MR KHALIL
did you ask in what direction the person had made off?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did.
MR KHALIL
did you reply?
LESLIE REDHEAD
he indicated the person had run off away from the tennis
courts and pointed in the direction of the wooded area.
MR KHALIL
can you help us, did he actually give you directions when
he was speaking to you?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Over to the left of your pointer.
MR KHALIL
behind the word college?
LESLIE REDHEAD
yes, a bit further over to the left, the tree line there
we can see.
MR KHALIL
I think that's right over on this corner here?
LESLIE REDHEAD
that's correct, yes.
MR KHALIL
thank you. Did he describe the person at all?
LESLIE REDHEAD
he didn't, sir, no.
MR KHALIL
did you look in the direction that Mr Huntley was indicating?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did, sir, yes.
MR KHALIL
how far could you see?
LESLIE REDHEAD
only just past the tennis courts because they were illuminated
at the time, so it is night vision from beyond that area.
MR KHALIL
did he tell you who he was, what his job was?
LESLIE REDHEAD
he did, he indicated he was the caretaker, and that he
knew there would only be one route away from that area.
MR KHALIL
did he describe that route at all?
LESLIE REDHEAD
he did, he said it was a track. He did at the time tell
me where that track led to, a street name but I have forgotten
what it was.
MR KHALIL
he had given you a fair amount of information, did you
want that information to be passed on to others?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did, I thought it was relevant.
MR KHALIL
Did you introduce him to anybody else?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did, there were some regular officers, a sergeant, I
took Huntley over to introduce him to the sergeant.
MR KHALIL
what about Huntley's dog, what was happening with that?
LESLIE REDHEAD
The dog was just running loose and there were a number
of my colleagues there on the grass area and it was running
amongst them and they were making fuss of him.
MR KHALIL
did colleagues of yours begin to walk towards the area
where Mr Huntley indicated this person made off?
LESLIE REDHEAD
they did.
MR KHALIL
and did they start to begin a search in the area?
LESLIE REDHEAD
they didn't get that far. They were crossing the little
road at the start of the roundabout and they got called
back.
MR KHALIL
did another Constable Edmonson come forward and speak
to Huntley?
LESLIE REDHEAD
He did. I walked back to where I was on the grass area,
looked across to the area indicated by Huntley, Huntley
came with me and PC Edmonson came across and spoke to
Huntley.
MR KHALIL
what was said?
LESLIE REDHEAD
PC Edmonson said "Are you the man who saw someone
running away?", Huntley said "Yes, I am",
so I left him in the company of PC Edmonson.
MR KHALIL
did you return back into their company?
LESLIE REDHEAD
did I, sir.
MR KHALIL
yes?
LESLIE REDHEAD
no.
MR KHALIL
was a dog handler contacted?
LESLIE REDHEAD
they attempted to get a dog handler but there was none
available at that time, sir.
MR KHALIL
was Mr Huntley made aware of efforts to contact a dog
handler?
LESLIE REDHEAD
He asked me because the van was subsequently driven off
with the regular officers in. Huntley came over and asked
me what was happening. I told him I believed they were
trying to get hold of a dog handler to do the search.
MR KHALIL
did he remain?
LESLIE REDHEAD
no, he didn't , I thanked him for his help and assistance
and said he could make his way away.
MR KHALIL
where did he go the?
LESLIE REDHEAD
in the direction from where he came, the direction of
the tennis courts.
MR KHALIL
about how long were you in his company?
LESLIE REDHEAD
about 10 minutes, sir.
MR KHALIL
what was his manner whilst you were with him?
LESLIE REDHEAD
with me personally.
MR KHALIL
yes?
LESLIE REDHEAD
he was quite relaxed. It was the same as having a conversation
with many other people we had in the course of the evening.
MR KHALIL
in the company of the other officers were you observing
him?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I was busy looking across the area, perhaps thinking of
conducting a search, or seeing if we could see movement
in the that area, sir.
MR KHALIL
Thank you very much indeed. There may be more questions.
MR COWARD
so you were with this man about 10 minutes?
LESLIE REDHEAD
Yes, sir.
MR COWARD
later I think you attended a video identification parade?
LESLIE REDHEAD
I did, sir, yes.
MR COWARD
you had no difficulty picking out the man on the identification
parade?
LESLIE REDHEAD
that's correct, sir.
MR COWARD
you had been with him 10 minutes, talking to him, was
he standing a couple of feet away from you?
LESLIE REDHEAD
he was, sir, yes.
MR COWARD
there was enough light at the place where you were talking
to Mr Huntley for you to see him quite clearly and what
he looked like?
LESLIE REDHEAD
yes, sir.
MR COWARD
and to see his face ?
LESLIE REDHEAD
yes, sir.
MR COWARD
thank you very much.
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