| The Dream Solution
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07/08/91
- RECORD OF TAPE RECORDED INTERVIEW of MICHELLE ANNE TAYLOR
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MT
Um, nurses, the main ones we have in the houses are nurses
and domestics.
DS G
And how many total staff of nurses and domestics would you
have at
DS G
the hospital?
MT
Working at the hospital?
DS G
Um mm.
MT
Um, I only know the total altogether including all departments.
DS G
Well, how many is that?
MT
183.
DS G
So the flats would cater for very very few number of employees
then? That's what we're saying? Now going on to your statements
can you remember making these statements first of all? Can
you remember the situation the time and the place?
MT
Yeah, yes.
DS G
The first one's dated the 4th June - I think this was taken
in the early hours of the 4th June after Alison's body was
discovered at 41 Vardens Road, and what I want to do is
just run quickly through this with you. It says here you've
worked at the Churchill Clinic since 6th July 1987, you
started work there as a Sales Assistant in the Accounts
Department, right?
MT
Yes.
DS G
You go on to say about John SHAUGHNESSY started work in
September 88, you got to know him 'cos you were working
closely with him.
MT
I believe some of the dates in the first statement are wrong.
Like if you look at the second statement you will see that
I couldnt remember the exact dates on the first statement.
DS G
Um mm.
MT
Like the dates I had my operation on.
DS G
I honestly wouldn't expect you to remember dates going back
to 1987 and 1988, but if you made a genuine mistake I can
understand that, but the content of these statements uh,
that you make, was the content correct as far as you're
concerned?
MT
Yes.
DS G
Everything in those statements is the truth?
MT
Apart from the dates on the first one.
DS G
Apart from the dates you just, when you met, what? The date
you met John?
MT
Um, I believe it was 1989 that John actually went into purchasing
and not 1988.
DS G
Um mm. Right, well instead of reading all through this statement,
perhaps I could ask you some detailed questions about John
SHAUGHNESSY in particular. When did your close relationship
start because I'm aware from these statements that you had
a relationship with John?
MT
In January of '89.
DS G
And how did that start?
MT
I had an operation and um, I had an operation on my knee
and um, John visited me in my hospital room, because I actually
had my operation in the Churchill Clinic and I had to work
late from then on because of driving in in the morning,
because my leg, I was allowed to drive but not so that I
had my foot on the clutch all the time, so I come in late
and I worked later, and John used to do all
MT
the gardening then, and that included trimming the flowers
inside and he used to come up and talk to me, and stay with
me when I was working late.
DS G
And when did you begin to become more intimate as it were?
MT
We started seeing each other from the end of January, going
out.
DS G
Yeah, that's what I'm getting at. Going out together sharing
social occasions and sort of behaving like boyfriend and
girlfriend, that' what I'm talking about?
MT
Yeah.
DS G
So when did that aspect start?
MT
From the end of January.
DS G
Had you fully recovered from your injury?
MT
I still wore a bandage and that on my knee.
DS G
But you had been released from hospital confinement?
MT
Yes.
DS G
And how much did you know about John SHAUGHNESSY at that
time?
MT
Um, mainly just that he was from Ireland and that when he'd
come over from Ireland and he was working at the Churchill
Clinic as a porter and earning some extra money by doing
flowers.
DS G
And how did your relationship develop? How did you feel
about him and how did he feel about you?
MT
Um, ...... do you mean in love wise?
DS G
Uh um, you try and explain it in your own words.
MT
Well after a couple of months of knowing John and being
with John and going out with him, and considering each other
as a proper boyfriend and girlfriend, I did love him.
DS G
The love that you felt for John, had you ever experienced
an emotion like that before with any other fellows? Like
I mean you can also have a close sort of boyfriend/girlfriend
of about 13 or 14, probably younger nowadays, but you never
experienced that when you were at school or had a crush
on any of the boys at school?
MT
Yeah I had, I mean it wasn't a mixed school, but I used
to go out with a boy called Terry who lived across the road
for a couple of months and then he moved away.
DS G
Uhmm. Well what I'm getting at, the feeling that you talk
about now that you had for John in the early part of 1989,
did you ever experience that feeling for any other fella?
MT
No. I hadn't shared that sort of relationship with any one
else.
DS G
Yeah, that's what, and you didn't feel for anybody the same
as you felt for him?
MT
No.
DS G
How did he feel about you?
MT
He loved me.
DS G
And how do you know?
MT
He told me.
DS G
How did he express his love for you apart from just telling
you?
MT
He didn't buy me anything specific, he bought me a flower
and would take me out places.
DS G
How often did you see him?
MT
Uh, in the beginning of the relationship it would be most
nights.
DS G
When did you sleep together for the first time?
MT
In March.
DS G
March 1989?
MT
Yeah.
DS G
Do you remember the date?
MT
I think it's the 23rd. I have it marked down in my diary.
DS G
When did you find out that he had a girlfriend?
MT
Um, I come back off holiday....
DS G
When was that?
MT
That would have been I think it was the end of August, beginning
of September of '88 um '89.
DS G
And how did you find out about the girlfriend?
MT
A lady on reception told me that John was engaged.
DS G
How did you feel about that?
MT
Very hurt.
DS G
You must have been devastated.
MT
I was, yeah. If I'm not mistaken I even left work early
and gave some reason for leaving work early and went home
to my mum.
DS G
So here are - the first guy that you've felt strongly about,
you've come back off holidays and found out that not only
has he got a girlfriend, but he's also engaged to be married
to her?
MT
Yeah.
DS G
How did he explain that away?
MT
When I actually confronted John, John told me that he was
engaged and that he was getting married next year. Um I
remember telling John what I felt about him then and that
I'd felt used, and that even my Mum had said what the Irish
are supposed to be called Irish
MT
Charmers. And I told him that as well.
DS G
Did he tell you how long he'd known this girl, or had been
going out with her?
MT
No he didn't.
DS G
So how long did you think he'd known her?
MT
Um, I didn't know until afterwards after we'd had the big
row and everything, but I think it was probably about three
years.
DS G
And who was this girl he was engaged to?
MT
Alison.
DS G
At that time did you know her other name?
MT
No I didn't, I only knew her as Alison.
DS G
What did you know about her?
MT
That she worked in Barclays Bank.
DS G
Where?
MT
In the Strand.
DS G
Anything else?
MT
Not at that time.
DS G
Did John tell you how long he'd been seeing her?
MT
No, not then, no. I wasn't very interested then to know
what he'd been doing or when he'd been seeing someone.
DS G
But if you'd been going out with him for six or seven months,
MT
Yeah,
DS G
and he'd been seeing you according to you, regularly,
MT
Yes.
DS G
during the week, when was he getting the time to see this
other girl?
MT
Well I was only working late and the most times I'd go home
would be about half eight in the week, and the first time
I ever stayed there was that weekend in March, the first
time I ever stayed with John, and I never saw him at the
weekends. So I imagine it would have been at the weekends.
DS G
So you've thought this out since that date, you've thought
about it and
MT
I did afterwards yes.
DS G
So you've concluded that the only time that he could have
seen this girl would have been at the weekends during the
time he was working at the Churchill and seeing you.
MT
Yes.
DS G
During the six months between January and July when you
discovered he was engaged was there anything that would
have caused you to be suspicious or given you any reason
to question his behaviour?
MT
No.
DS G
So you'd no inkling at all there was another girl on the
scene?
MT
No. He even had a ring on the engaged finger and when I
said, when I first ever met him, I said, "Are you engaged?"
and he said, "No." I said, "Oh, you just
wear a ring on that finger?" and he said, "Yes."
DS G
So what happend then, it's now July, he's engaged, you very
very hurt, very understandable, so what has happened then?
What's happened to the relationship what's happening to
you and what's happening to John?
MT
Um, I told him that I didn't want to see him again and I
didn't
MT
speak to him for, I would imagine a couple of months, I
can't remember exactly the time, but he would ring most
days and we worked a lot together because our jobs were
related and after a while we become friends and we would
talk on the phone and either one of us would ring each day
to say hello and good morning and how was things and that,
and then after a while, things just seemed to go back.
DS G
Who allowed things to go back?
MT
It would have to be me.
DS G
What, did you go out of your way to encourage it, or did
he actively pursue and chase you again?
MT
I didn't go out of my way to encourage it and things just
seemed to happen. We saw each other every day at work, we'd
be speaking every day on the phone.....
DS G
Now during this little time how, what was your feelings
for him? July you're upset, you're not speaking to him,
did you detest him, did you hate him, did you not want to
see the back of him? Uh, how did you feel about him?
MT
Yeah, I even, when I had to speak to him on the phone I'd
try my best so that I wasn't answering the phone, like someone
else would answer it and just take a message.
DS G
So there was at times, when you took steps to avoid him,
shall we say?
MT
Yeah.
DS G
What were your feelings toward this prospective wife he'd
got engaged to?
MT
When I first found out and I first knew about it, inside
I suppose I hated her for being with him, but at the same
time I felt sorry for her being with someone that was seeing
someone else.
DS G
Uh hum, that's ver well explained actually. How are we fixed
for time, I heard your watch going?
DC S
We've got about four minutes, we'll get a note and then
it will go on for another minute after.
DS G
Okey dokey, okey dokey. So when the relationship started
up again
MT
Yeah,
DS G
did it continue the same way that it was prior to July or
were you still on your guard or what was going on? How did
you feel? Did your feelings for him go back to the love
that you had for him before July '89?
MT
I don't think my feelings actually died away, I think someone
that you first met, and someone tnat you're seeing so strongly
and it's your first ever time, you still have them feelings
for that person.
DS G
Just picking up on that little thing you said, your first
ever time was John SHAUGHNESSY the first man that you'd
ever made love to?
MT
Yes.
DS G
Are you saying that your feelings for him never really went
away?
MT
No, I don't think they did, I mean if they had of and they'd
gone completely then I wouldn't have been able to take him
back.
DS G
Did you seek any sort of help or counselling at this time
or did you speak to your Mum or your sister?
MT
I spoke to my Mum.
DS G
And what did she tell you how to handle this?
MT
When it all happened and everything, you can imagine that
my Mum's feelings against John were very strong then, and
told me that there was plenty of other people out there
was someone else out there for me.
DS G
And how did you react to that advice?
MT
Well I listened to me Mum even though I was still upset
about the whole thing.
DS G
Basically you ignored her didn't you?
MT
At the time you take everything in but not completely.
DS G
What was John like at this time, after you got back together
again
MT
Um, John seemed to care for me even more, he was taking
care of me ringing me up all the time.
DS G
And how did you feel knowing that uh, there was this other
woman in the background?
MT
When you see a person and you don't see the other person
with them it doesn't really enter your head, it's only when
you see them with them that you realise there's someone
else. So you still feel like you're boyfriend and girlfriend
and there's no one else there.
DS G
So what you're saying is that when you were alone with John
you were able to put her out of your mind, but when the
two of them were together, it got to you?
MT
Well the only, the first time I ever saw them together was
in the December when we had a Chrsitmas party.
DS G
Where was that?
MT
On a boat.
DC S
That sound there indicates that this tape is running out.
I'm now going to turn the machine off and insert another
two tapes, Okay?
MT
Yes.
DC S
So if you will just bear with me. The time now is 11.35
by my watch and I am turning this tape off.
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